Series 4 - Episode 16

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Re: What exactly...

Post by WhiteDevil » Sat Oct 11, 2003 11:50 am

My guess is that (massively simplified) our world is one waveform and the Dungeon is another. When the two get in phase (i.e. on a diagram the two would be perfectly superimposed on each other) travel between the two can happen. A 180 degree phase shift is, I'm guessing, when the exact opposite happens. On a diagram, the waveforms would be doing the exact opposite of each other. As one would hit a peak, the other would hit a trough.

The waveforms getting into phase with each other is, I guess, akin to a causeway appearing to lead a path to an off-shore island.
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comic ending of km

Post by simiano » Fri Aug 13, 2004 3:13 pm

you guys remember the final episode of seris 4 when gundrada was swinging her sword. Ithoufght she looked well dangerous, until she dropped the thing lol!
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by Billy » Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:14 pm

I contributed to this thread when the episode originally aired on Challenge, but no harm on doing it again. For the first time in a long while, I missed the first few minutes of this episode. Which is a shame, as it's a BRILLIANT one.

First thing I saw was Brother Mace's joker incident, where he picks the 3 of hearts instead of the joker. Could be scripted, could be an actual error, but was still a fun moment nonetheless. Then came our last glimpse of a weeping door...huzzah! Well done to Tim Child for putting them out their misery (geddit?). Notice that the mouth faded in long before the actual face did.

Later came their boat ride, immediately following the scene where Motley dents Ariadine's pride (I guess it DOES sound like 'Arachnid' in a way), so I imagine Paul Valentine had to be quick changing into the boatman costume. Was funny that he kept answering Giles' questions with grunts.

Later still came the Corridor of Blades...they came very, VERY close to dying on a few occasions (I think they were let off on one of them) but managed to survive it, then went straight onto the crumbling bridge! Mogdred scares us silly for the final time, as the team go into yet ANOTHER hazard, the Block and Tackle...in Level 3! I have a sneaking suspicion that the production crew were trying to kill them off as quickly as possible, but despite taking a long time to actually line Giles up towards the door, they managed to do that too. Then into the transporter pad room...but just as it looked like they were gonna become S4's second winning team, a 180 degree phase shift occurred.

And then came the Christmas ending (ironic, considering we're currently in August), a ending that's pretty much universally despised by everyone. Still, Gundrada's swordplay neatly put an end to Series 4...either she did it once and they looped the tape, or Samantha Perkins is an expert at it. Still, she did drop it right at the end! Series 5 begins tomorrow!
Last edited by Billy on Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by Tom41 » Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:23 pm

The team encountered Brother Mace, who asked Giles to take off the eye-shield! He didn't like being spied on by magic shields ;)
Mace tried to give them a Three of Hearts card, saying it was a joker - but the team weren't fooled! Mace then gave them a real Joker card.

Next was another door-monster, Doorkis. Tried the Latin word that Mace gave them (Iocus), but then remembered the calling from the first door. One adviser suggested that they write down the calling now! Scored 2/3 on the true and false riddles, and the door opened.

Through a forest path in Dunkley Wood, and arrived at the entrance to Ariadne's Lair. Just managed to get into the portal before Ariadne came in!
In Ariadne's Lair, got some food and picked up a gold bar. Then Ariadne came in and they had to play the Joker card. This caused Motley to appear, and Motley told Ariadne a few insults to make her go away!

The Dunswater was next, the boatman asked for silver or gold for the fare. Apart from his initial statement about the Dunswater and the fare, the boatman never talks - only grunts. They gave him the gold and got across. Look closely and you'll see the background video sequence 'loop' just before cutting back to the advisers. Obviously they couldn't take an infinite amount of tape of the castle and moat!

In an eye-shield sequence, Giles asked where the door was - in front of him! Down the castle steps, and into a room with a table. On the table was a loaf of bread (they took as food), and an iron key. Giles picked the key up and put it in the knapsack at first, but took it out straight away!
Then called Merlin 3 times, and he appeared (though no longer in the stocks) and disspelled the skull that was floating around. Merlin instructed them to leave the key on the table, so he could 'conjure' the key back later.

In the next room there was the entrance to the Corridor of Blades, but there were two skulls moving back and forth over the entrance. They tried to check the chest and table first, but Pickle said there was nothing worth taking there. Just dodged the skulls (I think they hit him but were let off) and got into the corridor.

In the Corridor of Blades, Giles kept having to run between the left and right wall. They DEFINITELY died twice here, two of the blades touched here! Probably let off since it wasn't worth starting a new quest with only 5 minutes remaining this season! At the end, Giles ran through the door at the side even though the corridor had stopped!

Encountered Mogdred on the bridge, who started to crumble the bridge. They walked quickly forward and into the next room.
Demonstrated how NOT to do the Block and Tackle, paniced a lot and ran around! Still got through though, and into the transporter pad room.

Their quest had to end there though, as the season was coming to an end. Treguard spellcast UNITE to get Giles back to the antechamber. Suddenly Merlin entered, and used his wand to summon Christmas decorations in the antechamber! "You do want to be home in time for Christmas, don't you?"
This is because the original broadcast date (on CITV) was around the 21st December. I'm surprised Challenge didn't edit the Christmas references out (like they did with the CITV scroll in another series) - because it's nowhere near Christmas!

Gundrada was twirling her sword under the credits. She did seem to drop it at the end though, just before it cut off to the Broadsword logo - perhaps that's why they cut it off a bit early ;)
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by MoanaLiza » Tue Aug 24, 2004 8:24 pm

Tom41 wrote:Their quest had to end there though, as the season was coming to an end. Treguard spellcast UNITE to get Giles back to the antechamber. Suddenly Merlin entered, and used his wand to summon Christmas decorations in the antechamber! "You do want to be home in time for Christmas, don't you?"
This is because the original broadcast date (on CITV) was around the 21st December. I'm surprised Challenge didn't edit the Christmas references out (like they did with the CITV scroll in another series) - because it's nowhere near Christmas!

Gundrada was twirling her sword under the credits. She did seem to drop it at the end though, just before it cut off to the Broadsword logo - perhaps that's why they cut it off a bit early ;)
The team must have felt strange filming the end scene as it was filmed (I believe) during the school summer holidays around about this time of the year. obviously from the time of filming to the time of broadcast they had plenty of time to get home and open their presents, unless of course there was a major delay on the rail or even a longterm rail strike, but anyway.

Yes Gundrada did drop her sword at the end and I don't think that the sword twirling was looped.

Todays ep is one of my favourites one reason is due to memorable scenes. It's hard to tell to me whether or not the Brother Mace/Joker incident was scripted. Notice the way that Michael Cule keeps looking towards the production team, so I think that it wasn't scripted, just a mistake that was left in as a laugh. Maybe it was the production team or a member who done that for a laugh. The Motley and Ariadne scene somewhat remeinded me of the Folly and Cedric insults scene. Obviously there was time between filming that and the next scene. I liked the directing in the CoB where and the way the the advisors directed Giles from wall to wall even if Giles did appear to be touched a couple of times by blades. I think that Pickle made it easier for them than other teams to start with as he told Giles to duck and not so much to move from side to side. The other scene I found amusing was the was they advisors panicked, particularly Brett (I think) and directed or stuggled to direct Giles out of the B&T.

So overall had they have won had they have had more time or and not been the final team of that series. I mean yes it's too late now, but I really wanted them to win and they looked so dissappointed especially when the DISMISS spell was cast.
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by TheBrollachan » Wed Aug 25, 2004 8:18 am

Had a look back in slow motion. In the corridor of of blades they had a very narrow escape. I'm fairly certain one of the blades just scrapped Giles - but it's one of those things that the production crew couldn't have easily spotted.
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by darkDescender » Wed Aug 25, 2004 11:11 am

Let me just start by saying this ep had the best ending of any series. No contest. Oh. Sorry. Wait a second...Lie Mode cancel...ahem. Loved this ep. Started with a lovely scene of Mace butchering another language and blundering things up in true comedy style. (glad to notice this thread hasn't been taken over with arguments about how Mace mispronounced 'Iocus') A little further on Motley appeared and, in a million to one scene, he was actualy mildly entertaining. Crossed the dunswater. CoB. Went through this scene frame by frame. I'd class THAT blade as a miss. If it did hit it wouldn't have been enough to do more than tear his shirt a bit. Mogdred and the badly built bridge. Block and Tackle with plenty of panic and mayhem. Finished in the transporter room, and the less said about the chrimbo ending, the better. Credits sequence showed Gundrada demonstrating what she does to people who try to steal her knickers. Watch her blinking and you'll see it wasn't looped, and yes, she did drop it. Note to self: Punish Challenge! announcers severely.
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by TheBrollachan » Wed Aug 25, 2004 11:41 am

What did the Challenge announcer say this time? I tend to watch/record the 7:30am repeat as there is no announcer talking rubbish over the credits.
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by Eli » Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:09 pm

That was a brilliant episode I thought :) After the block and tackle is the most I've heard Treguard laugh before, and the advisors, especially the big one, were clearly enjoying themselves. Sorry to blaspheme, but I haven't enjoyed Series 4 in general as much as the earlier ones, but this could be my personal favourite episode I've seen so far out of all the series.

I found the ending rather dissappointing :( Usually at the end of the series they go through some of the rooms and show them dramatically callapsing. This end of series was less dramatic imo.

Keep in mind that there were only 122 days left until Christmas yesterday, so the ending wasn't TOO far out. ;) It was a tad out of place and random perhaps, but I'm the type of person who looks forward to Christmas on December the 26th so I don't mind.
Last edited by Anonymous on Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by MoanaLiza » Wed Aug 25, 2004 8:16 pm

They've started getting and displaying Christmas stuff and cards in the shops and on the shopping channels and it's not even Autumn yet. At work they are already planning our Christmas meal. Anyway that's enough about Christmas for another couple of months or so. Paleasssssse.
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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by DragonRider » Wed Aug 25, 2004 9:14 pm

I'm particularly amused by the fact that when Merlin dismisses the team, Brett looks at his hands as if he really was disappearing! It's real!! It's all real!!
Or he was looking down at himself to see if anything really would happen. ::)

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Series 4 Team 8

Post by ross » Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:48 pm

so how close were this team to winning Knightmare. You must say they were in with a fairly good chance after having got past the Block and Tackle (however they managed to do that) and the corridor of blades.

I reckon there was the transporter pads, the final door monster, and one more final room to go.

They had a tiny spell so they would have needed to use that at some point as well.

And that was basically it.

I wonder if the Knightmare production team could have let them carry on filming, and then edit things out.

Truth is we will never know now what could have happened. A bit of a shame really.

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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by ross » Tue Feb 01, 2005 11:35 am

Right since I have this recorded from challenge I will give my opinion on the corridor of blades incident.

Now first of all you must remember since 1990 (was it really 15 years ago now) that technology has moved on quite a lot.

For instance one can now make use of a "slow motion" feature on your video recorder.

Now the team had 16 blades in the CofB, and the first two Pickle did the guiding.

Blade 4, and Blade 8 seem to be the ones being contested.

Blade 4: The blade came from the left hand side, just as blade 2 is, the team hadn't move left or right since blade 2, only up or down, so why should they die, when the teams guiding was no worst than Pickles.

Blade 8: I honestly think the fast forward buttons and rewind buttons on my video screen are now worn out. I reckon the benefit of the doubt was given to the team here, but I DON'T THINK THEY WERE LET OFF.

A few things to say on this:

Giles was a fair portion of the way into the room. (Compared to the position we saw him on the TV screen.)

The blade gets bigger as it comes nearer the camera.

At the point where it passes Giles it is too close to call.

The blade gets bigger AFTER it passes Giles, as it goes nearer the screen. This is where it does appear to hit him. However the blade is past him at this point.

And no I don't buy the theory they were let off, just because there were 5 minutes of the season left. They introduced a new team in series 8 with about 8 minutes left. If they had have died with 5 minutes left, I'm sure between the 8 teams they could fill enough space by editing back in some conversations. (An average of 1 minute 36 seconds a team, think of how many rooms a team has, I guess you are talking about less than 10 seconds a room.)

I'm sure someone (Tim Child) oncve said on this board, they there was someone who took a live decision on things such as the CofB, and that is good enough for me, at the end of the day someone who is human has to make a decision, and even looking on slow motion on my video still doesn't make me sure.

But given the technology at the time used, it's almost an impossible decision to make.

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Re:Series 4 Episode 16

Post by JoeGrocottJames » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:56 pm

ross wrote: I'm sure someone (Tim Child) oncve said on this board, they there was someone who took a live decision on things such as the CofB, and that is good enough for me, at the end of the day someone who is human has to make a decision, and even looking on slow motion on my video still doesn't make me sure.
Yes, Tim Child did mention this and it was in relation to this death - the team were given the benefit of doubt.

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Re:Series 4 Team 8

Post by frieza » Sun Feb 06, 2005 10:30 am

It's a real travesty with this team; not only were they probably the most enthusiastic of the series, but also they successfully completed nearly every hard puzzle in the space of 5 minutes (think the skull entrance to the corridor of blades, then the corridor itself, then Mogdred and the wall, then the block and tackle AND THEN the transporter room,which they ran out of time on). This team at least deserved some commendation rather than the D-I-S-M-I-S-S crap they got.

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